Sometimes, under the Apple Menu, the Help is the hierarchical help, sometimes it is command-H. It is unpredictable as to when which one will come up. But if the command-H is present, bringing up the Tool Manager will always make the hierarchical help appear. Is anyone else getting this behaviour? FB 2.3, Sys 8.1 (and lower), PMac 5400. Peter mailto:peter@... http://www.isoma.com